The Midlife Warrior: Choose Reinvention Over Decline

0:01 This program is designed to provide general information with regards to the subject matters covered. This information is given with the understanding that neither the hosts, guests, sponsors, or station are engaged in rendering any specific and personal medical, financial, legal counseling, professional service, or any advice. You should seek the services. Of competent professionals before applying or trying any suggested ideas. Behoy, Captain David Gallimore welcomes you board The Regenerate Show live Monday's ten am Pacific on KFOHD Radio at kfohd dot com. We dive into the real messy work of transforming our lives. Leadership and organizations. Bring your hot mess and confusion, lead with clarity, courage, and come together. Let's strengthen our resilience, accelerating the health of ourselves, people, plant and profits. Now here's your host, Captain Dave, your personal regenerator.

1:14 All aboard. The Boy, and welcome to episode seventeen of The Regenerate Show. I am so so excited to be here with you. This show is about creating a space for our guests to share authentic and vulnerable, true stories about the messy middle of their transformation. I want to point to hope. Regenerate is about how you can become somebody who brings more resilience, purpose, authentic energy to the people you love, to our communities, or plan our only ship, despite what others will say about Mars, and it definitely needs our So what is the definition of regeneration, you may ask, Well, here's my definition, and it continues to evolve as I learn and live. The regeneration draws from three point eight billion years of life zone logic, storing vitality across every living system we inhabit from ourselves, our families, our teams, our organizations or communities. So together we can transform beyond merely doing no harm, which is the definition of sustainable, lie to becoming like a healthy for us, endlessly generating resilient, abundant conditions for all life across all generations, really to flourish.

2:49 So the secret to regeneration, I believe, is learning from people who are living it in the mud, fingernails dirty, in the messy middle, not from the performative summit, looking down, So doing inner work that I've been doing the last four and a half years, part of my messy middle, part of my midlife transformation has been shifting habits and beliefs and ultimately my identity. So one of the reasons why I created Regenerate is I'm dedicated to lifting purpose driven leaders up and connecting them in bonds of love and adventure and creating leadership and impact my core values and as a transformational guide in a maritime captain, a lifelong learner. That's what I've been dedicating this chapter of my life to. So this theme today is the midlife warrior.

3:55 Choose reinvention over decline. What if it exhaustion you feel in midlife isn't the beginning of your decline, but an invitation to your greatest reinvention. I love that what if everything that once energized you running dry is not a breakdown, but a signal that it's time to become someone new. For twenty five years, my professional coach and budding friend, Chris RW has coached top executives to the summit of their careers and watched many of them arrive only to ask themselves, is this all there is? To help answer this and other simple but not easy questions, Chris and his wife Sarah co developed and co facilitate the midlife Warrior out of the UK in Wales. During this experiential program, they reframe the disorientation of midlife is completely normal and far more than that, it's really the richest opportunity for transformation.

5:06 The catches it demands we do things differently. I can adjust to that, and sometimes it's hard to teach an old dog Nutrix, but I'm here to point to hope again that it's worth it. So in this episode of Regenerate, Chris and I we're going to choose reinvention over to Cline. We're going to find some clarity when we map things that are not working to things that could work better. Why purpose becomes that non negotiable in the second half of life. If you're new to this show, our promise is threefold. We're going to have some fun today. When we're laughing, we're learning to leave you inspired and invite you to grab a pen, take some notes, and apply just one thing before you fall asleep tonight, because informations happen here. So I'd like to bring on now as our second guest on the Regenerate Show. Second time appearing, I should say on the Regenerated Show, my coach and sense Chris.

6:17 Ru Well, hello David, very much of those kind words. So now you are in Wales. Now you and Sarah moved and are you out of boxes? Yes, we are out of boxes, although it is amazing where you still find the occasional one lurking in the back and think that's where that thing went. Wonderful after of course you've now replaced the item that you've been hunting for for the last six months. Indeed, in fact, strange story new house they redecorating, had to color match something in the in the kitchen to do a repaint job, bought the appropriate paint, promptly lost it and have had to get and read buy it again. What can you do?

7:02 Classic, Well, you will feel a little bit better when I share that I have bought some hair products and lotions and nail clippers because they're carefully filed away in a box somewhere in Mason. We're not sure if they're at one of too many storages or at our cottage on Lake Cushman. So yeah, it's a thing. So you inspire me to get out of our own boxes, as we've just now sold our home which was part of our medlife. Congratulations, a nice reinvention. Indeed, so to help our listeners get to know you just a little bit better, tell us what that one thing that you just love to do that just lights you up.

7:54 Well, it's changed you see, you'd have asked me twenty odd years ago. Then the instant answer was skiing stick me on the top of a mountain, going down hill at a rate of lots, where all you can consider is staying upright. But now having moved to Wales, of course, it's now renovation and recreation of new opportunities. We're looking at different ideas and options. Part of the piece and coming here is as we're going to talk about that really creating opportunities for people who re look at their lives and recreate new opportunities and see it as an open door, not one that's closing, as you've sort of alluded to. And when you're a coach, you offering coaching yourself as much as you're coaching your clients. So you know, I've only last week I was out buying another domain to think of another creative outlet for doing some some physical manual labor, as it were, in building and renovation barrels of all things. How about that for something different, very therapeutic, totally different. Who knows where that will take it.

9:10 Well, it's so great that you are looking at kind of hands on experiences. My son Ian and I are very excited to renovate different objects. He's fascinated with metal tools and metal appliances that often wind up in the landfill. Yes, and have so much more life in them. They just need some tender, loving care. And the whole family had such a great experience. It was a difficult experience, but a great outcome renovating our home the last two years and then putting it on the market that I have ambitions of doing that again with our family, perhaps even building a home together. So there's something mad your client about touching and feeling tools and you don't have to renegotiate the cut that you've made on the barrel plank.

10:09 It stays, whereas in so many other aspects of the work that you and I do, it's just negotiation and persuasion. It's a good balance and as much as it's creative, it's an outlet for physicality and when we spend so much of our time, if you like, in our head and our hearts, the output and being outside in the countryside and doing stuff in the fresh air is very invigorating. And so we're sort of partly practicing what we preach in terms of retreat creating retreats where people can come and think about it. We do it ourselves every single day, thinking about where we're going to do and what can you do, which is great fun, just you know, being open to the idea and thinking why not.

10:55 Yeah, and you're not that far away from mont Blanc or other cool it is in. Ye Europeah absolutely, in fact that you used to get to zak and Za in Austria and hop on a plane and you can leave it in the morning and you can be skiing at lunch time. It's very nice. Yeah. And if I can get you and Sarah out to the Seattle area, we could do what I like to call a surf and turf, so we can go skiing in the morning and then sailing in the afternoon. Oh yeah, excellent. So another question, I kind of purposely limited my own introduction of you just to allow our listeners to hear from your own lips, your own words, your own heart.

11:43 How did you become the person that you have become? What's a brief origin story Chris. Yeah, sure, Well I spent twenty years in the pharmaceutical industry from carrying a bag up TOPTMD for a farmer company. And this story is very very relevant now to the middle life group piece, because effectively it was a case of how do I what do I do? Do I actually stay in the organization and become possibly the MD of that organization, or do I go out and try my luck with setting up a catching business as somebody had actually asked me to come and help them establish a business. And the choice actually sounds fiscal, but actually it was more like, actually, I've got a three year old daughter. I was about forty at the time, and my question was to myself was where do I want to spend my time? Do I want to be watching her grow up and visit the school and be there for games and the like, or do I want to be on the plane a one hundred days a year, which was the other alternative. So, needless to say, I chose the I want to be and be with my daughter, and as a result, I think I have a fantastic relationship with her. But more importantly I was able to strike a balance and in doing that I also recognized in the early piece about okay, I need some kind of buffer. I could get a redundancy piece, leadlexit the

13:16 organization and give myself sort of six months or a year cover, which is always useful to do. But you start to trust yourself, you have to go across the cliff edge of the institution that you found yourself in, who has nurtured you. And in my case, I'd basically grown up with this organization and it's as it been taken over over the years, but broadly had stayed there and just grown with it. So I had eighteen twenty years of safety and security and the knowledge that I would pretty much guarantee a job unless I was in a complete idiot. So this was kind of scary. But the thing I've kept on reminding myself was I have agency.

14:00 You know, it doesn't end as soon as the door shuts of leaving that organization. You can actually do stuff. It's amazing who knew I did, and me being me being a sort of hyper sales marketing director and having been in the farmer industry, I absolutely had to prove to myself that I was perfectly capable as a coach and needed to get my first client in anybody but the pharmacutic industry. So I set out deliberately to prove that the product IEME was valid, and my first client was Dell Computers, interestingly enough, so having established proof of concept, I then went back and continued on and did that for fifteen well since then, so it's two thousand and one January two thousand and one till today, so we are twenty five years plus. But that story is so so relevant to the conversations that we now have around Midlife Warrior, because we're I want it. We came here very deliberately with the idea of helping people who've reached that forty five fifty fifty five year piece, and they're kind of going, ah, I always had this dream to be X fill in the blank. But I'm so safe.

15:17 I'm secure. The kids are just about to go to university. Am I going to help them with the debt? Am I going to help them with this? I'm going to do that. Oh dare I leave? Nobody will want me now I'm fifty. Well in the case, and we also very very specifically recognized that ladies, particularly notwithstanding all the other challenges that leadership brings for senior ladies in business. Then we have the physiological challenge of menopause and perimenopause, just to add another level of complexity to it. And so we thought, well, there's an opportunity for conversations and discussions, and we set up a retreat last year, the pilot Recht treat effectively on the basis of a ladies having an intimate group of four people who with my wife leading the piece. She's an ex medic and executive coach and yours truly here as well co facilitating this workshop.

16:18 And the whole point about this was two, look at where you are, what your ambition was, what was the fear that was stopping you, How are you dealing with the health and safety and well being of yourself now at this age for right which brings in all of those for the ladies that also there's complications or physiological adaptations that are going on. And then how are you going to fund this dream? The financial scope and we'd spend we spent three nights, two days on this very useful driver obviously bespoke conversation and had a fantastic retreat and the ladies are still talking to each other. They're still self supporting. They went on and have made changes to their lives as a direct results of the retreat.

17:12 And we've got, you know, the testimonies to show for it, which is lovely. And all it takes, as it were, is to stop, is to pause and look and realize that you have agency and can go forward and you are not alone. That's the interesting challenge. So that's kind of where the origin peace, if you like. Coming back to when I started, I felt that personally, that challenge, and interestingly, in my career as a coach, in the first sort of ten years, I had one particular client who absolutely took me on the basis of helping people who were passed over but they still wanted to keep or they were going to be leaving the organization, but they wanted them to do a cracking job for that period.

18:01 How could you do that? And it all comes down to personal motivations and finding the dream and the ambition, re energizing people back into creating their personal roadmap so they once again have direction. So many people have just lost direction and are settling for what they've got. So there's a few threads that I would love to pull with you. First of all, thank you for the work that you and Sarah are doing on behalf of really really capable people who might be going through changes in their health. As you were saying, just the normal life cycle, if I could call it that, and especially for women. My understanding, Chris, I've not helped this or experienced this, but apparently male menopause is a thing. It's not really.

18:59 Yeah, there's there's a slightly different dynamic, of course, and there's certainly a different physiology, but there is there are some some similarities I suppose in that sense, but medically speaking, the from the women, the women have the men cuffed in that sense. It's a genuine normonal piece there, which and the challenge in the here is that the UK general practitioners and bury In my dad was one, and I have a great high regard for them, don't know how that knowledgeable about how to treat it. That the treatment piece is quite limited, but there are absolutely people who specialize in this and they do fantastic work. And if if the listeners did nothing else but looked up Louis Newsome, if they come across that name, she's an absolute expert in the area and have clinics throughout the UK, and if people choose to go, you can make significant changes to the way that you're dealing and experiencing the problems associated with that, which enables you to stay in the game. And why is this relevant Because I had many conversations with folk who, once the door is slightly open, are saying, well, you know, I'm just noticing that I'm getting this vacant mind or I'm not I'm not really concentrating quite as well as I used to, And what's that all about? And I can't really do anything about it?

20:29 So can I really go for that top job? Can I really be the CEO? If I can't cope with this? What's going and all the doubt starts to creep in? Well, the reality is you can and things can be done about it. But if you don't have the conversation and take a take the time to look out, then it's a problem. It's a problem for people. And the last point I want to make on that is that we recognize, of course that has a fundamental paradoxical stigma associated with that. If I raise my hand and say, okay, honestly, i'm forty eight, I think I'm paramount Apausal. I'm noticing it's changing the way that my performance is, so I want to do something about it. And there's something over here that's saying I put my hand up, they aren't going to even consider me for the job.

21:17 So just to be clear, I did not want you to think that I was elevating male symptoms to anything close to female symptoms. And my lovely wife went too early men a pause and it was really really challenging. So yeah, it's a whole step function for women, and as you highlighted, it does give people pause to even communicate where they are in that part of their life because then people look at them differently. I've heard that about answer patients that tell their boss us that they're undergoing treatment, and you know, people look at them differently, and then they're kind of Some will say that, well, that's kind of the end of their growth opportunities, which is so limiting. The second threat I wanted to pull was read a book. I'm going to forget her name, but I'll put her name in the show notes. By the way, we've rebel our producer is adding some great banners, so including the Midlife Warrior as well as doctor Louise. Yeah, she's all over this. I would submit this book. It was written by a London business school professor lived to one hundred. I think is the title that midlife I

22:48 might lobby a little bit because I'm sixty four, that midlife now could be well into the sixties, so forty to sixty. I'm just saying because I don't feel like I'm sixty four. I feel like I'm in my forties. I don't really feel that that different. Yeah, but the world does treat us differently. I got aged out of executive program management at fifty eight and had to or chose to pivot. Were as great hair valued ah maritime captain, so well, tell us a little bit about your own kind of midlife warrior experiences if you as part of the move to Wales, is that part of the strategy of your midlife warrior experience?

23:39 That's exactly it. I mean the pivot basically in that sense is go literally move across the country, backed into another country in order to be able to get the balance that we wanted because and we talked about don't talk about retirement, hate the word. We talk about returning to ourselves. So coming back to ourselves where we can go and do other things. So the the restoration, if you like, is illustrated a little bit by my good lady, as I say, she does these these retreats, and she's also a Tudor author, so we have a passion around the Tudor travel guide and Tudor Tudor world, and that, if you like, as an example of regeneration and rebirth for me doing I've always liked tech and producing and creating films and doing reels and all sorts of things with Instagram. Done it for coaching, and we do films for supervision and all sorts of bits and pieces in the coaching world. But for Tudor stuff, I've done a lot of production on podcasts and films, and we to kind of a very long story short, there are now runs.

25:03 After five years of doing all this and writing novels and having a big following on Instagram and the like, now runs a tour company and now creates a living from that tour company as good as her coaching business was in the past. And that's a very good example, if you like, of a complete fault fass change of direction, being open to the idea of what's the passion. How can I create that and turn it into something that's biscally supportive, But fundamentally it's done out of the passion for the subject in the first place, and the money follows afterwards, to which is kind of the way forward.

25:45 So one of the essences of midlife Warrior programs is saying, what is your passion? What is it that you want to do? By the way, life is not a rehearsal. If you want to do it, Let's have a conversation for forty eight hours about what would it take for you to live that dream? What do you actually need to make that change? And everybody has a dream of some description, and the question is how can you make a version of that your reality. So, in terms of myself, the rebirth or the regeneration has definitely moved from one percent doing nothing but coaching into trying to do lots of different interventions, becoming giving back into the coaching world by being part of the governing body for our governing body and supporting the coaching world in that sense. But stepping into the judo world is just a totally different piece.

26:45 But we've managed to re engineer it that where you know, effectively, our hobby is creating a living and the journey for us to continue on way off into our votage. I'd see no reason why I can't. I can keep on coaching. I picked it twenty years ago, around that time, around this I think, well, coaching is good because age is not a barrier to coaching. I felt that in a little bit. Does that makes sense? I think I'm rambling of it. Absolutely. Yeah. I love what you said about retirement. It really is. I think in this day and age, especially with the modern events and health care and people's commitment to eating better and sleeping more and movement, I think there's a lot more awareness and plus most of us don't have to bang steel and metal and break our bodies by the time we're sixty five. So what a great story about Sarah finding her passion or maybe she had it, but now she's fully expressing it. And then what I love about your piece in that and Margaret and I are trying to figure out our own what does our shared future look like? Co create that together.

28:12 You've you've leaned in and are bringing value things that you enjoy the media producing. I don't want to necessarily ask you how are you with you know, tutor tights, and. Oh, I don't mind, I because I do the The other part of this is and how I actually got into tutors in the first place, because Sarah was doing some reenacting and inviting me to come along, because gents are somewhat of a rare commodity into the reenacting for the point that you make everybody's comfortable in sticking on hose.

28:54 But it's great fun and I do. I was happily. I've played all sorts of roles of Tudor, including Henry the Eighth believe it or not, Bit with Beard and what have you, And latterly I play Cromwell and play nobles and gentry and all sorts of things, and I do that quite regularly. In fact, I will be going off in a couple of weeks time to Barklay Castle and be will be as an event on there. I should be playing a role and doing some Tudor dancing, all part and parcel of the whole rich pageantry. It's all great fun. And also on the tours that Sarah does get re enactors to come in, including myself on occasion on some of them and pop up and surprise the guests and entertain the guests. It's great fun, a good thing to do in totally different.

29:46 So rather than run my promo, Chris, would you be interested in just doing a brief verbal commercial? And what I can do is ask rebel to the Midlife Warrior and I can go to that website, but she's got to present it. Would that be helpful and just let people know. Is it purely folks that are local or do you find people from all over the globe that been coming to your program? Yeah, well, I'm happy to have a stab at. That's basically people come across broadly. It's been the UK based, although we having said that it depends on where our client base sits. You know, it's come from our existing network and most of our clients are UK, but we do have some European clients and some American clients. So the scope is effectively open to anybody who's prepared to jump on a plane and get over here, or we jump on a train. That one of the ladies who came to this retreat came down on train from Leeds seven and a half hour journey to get here. Part in fact of the process is that it is a journey.

31:06 If you're going to do this, it's one of life's journeys. You're going on your personal lifetime journey of change. So we actually actively thought about the fact that we wanted people to have to travel perversely as it sounds, to get to us, and it would be a little bit awkward, it would be a little bit long, because you're going away from wherever your work is. And the point is, the principle of retreats is to go away into the countryside where it's quiet. We take people onto the beach and take people around, walking around the countryside, and it's open to anybody who has the thought in their head that is this really all there is is this? Am I now committed for the remaining fifteen years. Well, if that's something you want to talk through, and we, of course, well I'm quite happy to have and I'm certainly not hapy to have initial conversations, no obligation conversations with people, just to have a chat about it and see if they would like to spend some time considering their life and where they are. The programs are all on the website that you're very kindly showing Midlife Warrior dot Com and it's there for those to see. That's how we do combinations of individual retreats and coaching programs or group retreats as I've alluded to, for groups of ladies or gents ultimately who can come back and think about where they are and where they want to go, what they want to do. So middlife Warrior dot com that's the

32:39 place to go. And if you want to chat, get in touch. Okay, love it. That is such a great idea of leveraging your beautiful new region that you and Sarah are exploring and figuring out what might be a great experiential component to the You said it was three nights in two days. That's right. So we have a small there's a small hotel which we take over effectively and it's solely for the group. If it's a group, and if it's individuals, then we have and you can see them on the website. There's sort of I call it them hobbit hats. Can we look a little bit at the Hobbit Heart in the Hobbit, But there they're sort of clamping pods where people can come and we in the evenings we let people off and they have a quiet evening for themselves to think about what they've learned through the day and off if they're on it, if it's an individual one on one, yes, but otherwise in the group it's just in the hotel and on at into locale.

33:48 I would be very interested in pulling another thread from from what you've been sharing. This will bring us, you know, to the second part of our three part series here. So the threat that I think was so challenging for me going through my midlife experience was my rewiring of my identity and as you know, my coach for the last year in a bit for me, anyway, I put my finger on my own nose. It was going from corporate identity where the brand of like an IBM or a Boeing or a cap Gemini that opens doors that I didn't really quite appreciate. Well, I was no longer under that brand and it's now just me myself and I second part of that identity was title. I mean, I had a vice president title when I decided to finally pick the corporate crazy to the curve, as I like to joke. And so part of my identity was you know, my parents are proud of me because I'm a vice president, something that my dad had aspired to at Boeing, but because of procession or layoffs or whatever,

35:20 he didn't rise to that level. So this was me being able to live part of his dream and part of the identity was making really good money and having phenomenal benefits, medical benefits and paid vacation and all of that. And when you asked or you mentioned that people often will have one or more fears that caused them to settle or to remain where they are, even though it doesn't hit them up anymore. And there's so much more unfinished business, so much unrealized potential. But I'm telling you, man, that is a significant just those three things that I ticked off. The brand, the title, and the money for the benefits. And if you want to add a fifth, I guess would be selling myself. Great at doing the work, but telling about what I do just felt really boastful.

36:30 And you know, I grew up in a family that just did good work. It didn't tell them what it you know, what we were doing. We just we showed up and we did our work, and that was sufficient, you know, to feel good about one self. So those were challenging rewirings. You have any thoughts about we want a there's. A maybe slightly generational, I don't know, but there's certainly a piece around if I work hard, people will see I'm working hard and they will recognize me and promote me, which exists within the body of work. But also if I am seen to be successful, then what does that look like? And we help people create their road what we call the roadmap. What's your roadmap from now? One of the first questions involved in that and helping people understand what they want to actually do with their life is what does success look or feel or sound like for you now? Because everything that's described has been up to a point, so achieving the vice president, the CEO of the ND whatever it may sell, director, whatever that is, has served a purpose for you as an individual. What is that now? And as we sit here today, notwithstanding what that's delivered, where do you want to go now?

37:59 Because everything that you you recounted represents a historical fact. So everything therefore is a case of if the fears are of are trying to maintain or preserve whatever level you've achieved now. The problem with that, of course, is that if you're not moving forward then usually falling back. You can't stand still, and we don't have the energy of a fifty year old as twenty five at the endge of a twenty five year old at fifty. We have experience, and we bring a lot more to the party in different ways, but we don't necessarily have that same energy and enthusiasm. Because we've done over twenty years, we kind of know what's going to happen next, and the enthusiasm and the energy's gone. So there's a question about the fiscal question, which is why one of the quadrants of our weekend is about, well, how are you going to fund this? There's a personal question for people to get comfortable the idea that I am going to reference myself in a different fashion. So if you are massively externally referenced, by which I mean you pay a lot of attention to what other people say and you you how you are viewed, and that's how you get your validation, that's going to be more of a challenge, right.

39:24 So if you're going to set up on your new venture, then part of that is going to be maybe a reidentifying how I see myself and what actually now will success look or feel like for me, and it does change. I mean, it absolutely does change for people at twenty five it may well have been important to be able to run the business. So many mds get to that age and go I've done that, now, now what almost by definition because they are very capable individuals, they also can get bored and they want to do something else. Entrepreneurs, as you well know, fail more often than they succeed, but they get themselves up and start again and go again.

40:14 And that's a very interesting part of the regeneration process and the midlife warrior process is recognizing that you have agency. I've mentioned at the top about having agency that you can go again, and that success or failure is all part of the game. We do a lot of work with biotechs, and biotechts exist on failure, testing pharmaceuticals to the point of what what doesn't work, what doesn't work, what doesn't work, that does work? You know, we live on in those in those worlds on failure. It's educational. So when it comes to personal transformations, then there are some hygiene factors there of course, some Maslow factors. Where am I in my life if I'm if I'm just gone through a divorce and I'm now changing everything and suddenly my income is halved or my wealth is halved because of the divorce process or whatever. I now need to do something else. So you have imperatives from that.

41:16 The question is that that time, well, what do you Therefore? If you want to be the most successful you can be, you can go with your existing Is that going to be good enough? Is that still relevant or is there an opportunity to actually to try something different? Atally? It just depends on personal circumstances. So there's a there's a whole multiplicity of identity issues wrapped up in this, and it's a really very sound point to consider, and it comes back to some of those early questions that we ask to help people understand how they will see themselves. So it's a great point. I think you're spot on with the this roadmap process, and I suspect that you do something similar to what I do with clients that are going through change. They want to leave their current roles, they want to try something new, they want to pick the corporate crazy to the curb, whatever they're objective when they're hiring you or I or Sarah, anybody that's in this world to help see around the help our clients see around the corner that rewiring identity. So it sounds simple for me anyway, it was very, very fraud And I'll put in the show notes some of the early early guests Mathea Graham, who helped me do that, and Eckert certainly you have

42:50 helped me. But separating you know, I'm not my title, I'm not three hundred thousand dollars a year. I'm not IBM or Boeing or Capgemini or some other global brand, and that there's worth intrinsic to the individual being alive and being a good person and being in service to others. And the last thing I'll say, it's really helped me, and you've been a key part of this as my executive coach and business coach, and sense is to give yourself some grace and compassion and to maybe even grieve the loss of some parts of my identity in particular.

43:46 But others right or they're going through this process and as painful as that can feel in the moment when you're being supported by somebody else, I don't know that I could have done this on my own, frankly, or it would have taken longer. This is back. And that's a really interesting point because there are people around who can help you if you stop to look, and of course fear tends to close down those opportunities, as in the assumption is there's no one that can help me, Nobody understands what I have to deal with, nobody can appreciate that, etc. We have a name for fear or an acronym faar obviously fantasy expectations appearing real. Yeah, and we hallucinate effectively and we act as if it's the truth. And that's the challenge.

44:40 But by bringing that back into a conscious awareness, bringing the fear out into the open, and understanding that that actually is a possibly very rational fear that was built up from some experience, but now you're actually taking a different road by choice, then that gives you some sense of control over the piece. Yes, loss, Understanding that is very very useful, and to go through that grief cycle, associating out Coogler ross is very helpful. Here you get all sorts of loss, and this is certainly one of them. But the interesting thing I like the spring, summer, autumn, winter metaphor because you know you're going through any kind of transformation. As with the seasons, there's a point of early creation of the idea, racing growth through the summer, an autumn harvest, if you like, and then a wintering of the idea that has to be has to die or the piece that has to die in order that I can rebirth something new and put all my energy into something new in a lovely figure of eight.

45:55 Yeah, So when our final third time is never our friend Chris and our final third of the show, I would love to just hear maybe one or two stories. They don't have to be, you know, the named person, but maybe anonymized, And I'm happy to share just a little bit of my own positive outcomes because going through this messy middle it can take a while, and so I want to have our listeners feel like, Okay, there's there's some rainbow and silver lining and more sunshine, you know, maybe not at the end of the process, but even partly through the middle of the messy middle of the process.

46:45 So I'm just curious if you had a story that you'd be willing to share from the warrior, well. From the marior point of view, for one of the ladies springs immediately to mine, who basically was reframing her her approach and comfort about shifting out of a very senior position and into moving into one where title wise, she wouldn't have the same title, but would gain much better enjoyment and greater scope from what she wanted to achieve, And effectively she did achieve that. She not only did she rationalize going for that position, but she achieved the shift and has loved every minute of it, never looked back.

47:33 And it's one of those simple, very simple pieces of putting the giving the opportunity to frame. I kind of want to go that way. I want to identify, I want to make the change, but I'm kind of stuck in this and if I do that, it could threaten my family, could threaten my revenue, can threaten this, that and the other. Do I really want to make the change? Well, I think I do going through it. But if I don't change, what happens? What's the fear that's holding me back? The actual fear is fill in the blank, and the fear is usually not exactly what you think it would be in the first instance, or it's a combination of two or three things. And then identifying that as soon as you've named it, then it becomes something you can deal with. So in that case, that was a very nice, very simple example of somebody who changed their change their focus and change their approach essentially and moved on. There are plenty of people who've changed their careers. One guy I work with decided to excuse the dog, decided to should he or should he not stay on that particular career ladder, or should he actually change and go across into a different part of the organization. And that different part of the organization was that stepping out of his technical comfort zone in a pet Patrick chemical company. But

49:07 in doing so, it's the old story of you know, the broader you go, the border experience you gain. Then some years down the track, people are going to go, yes, you're capable, and you should be able to go for the very senior position to VP positions, etc. There's plenty of the scenarios, but in order to do that, you have to step out of the current. Yes, thank you for those two wonderful, wonderful wanted to hope stories chs. Thank you so much for being back on the Regenerated show a second time. You always have some great value. So for our next port of call. Our theme is transforming Vision into Reality and my guest will be Marcus Bauer, an Olympian sailor and a fascinating founder of a software company by the title bull Escape.

50:01 And I've been using his software now for about six months and have found it to be incredibly helpful. So please join us for episode eighteen next Monday at ten am Pacific one pm Eastern six pm CET on KFOURHD dot com on behalf of Chris Rebel Medler, our producer, and our entire talk for media team. Please stay healthy, stay safe, We need you. We're better together. Now let's go regenerate. Thank you for listening to Regenerate with Captain Dave on k forour HD Radio. We invite you to give yourself grace and grace the messy middle and see you every Monday at ten am Pacific time. Until then, you got this